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Horhiro
Draconis Combine
Samurai
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1625
Location: United States
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 Posted: 13-Oct-2017 18:50 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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So, let me first say that I love 3025. It’s the era that I started playing this game in and I still find it the most fun. Mostly because of nostalgia, heat management, simplicity, and well let me be honest- the Unseens.
That being said, I do also like the whole clan invasion, Return of Kerensky thing. The Omni Mech miniatures, and the story line that is. Not the tech. Nor do I really like 2750. Double heat sinks kind of ruined it for me. I know what your probably thinking, “There has to be technical advances so as to move forward!”
Well I do like a lot of the after 3025 ammo choices. Variant Autocannon ammo, LRM ammos, Infernos for all sizes of SRMs. Most of the other stuff, meh!
So where am I going with this? How about designing the original Clan Invasion Omni-Mechs with 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? I’m thinking that the reason why the Clans could still have advantages over Inner Sphere armies could be for multiple reasons:
More Mechs, pretty simple, including that they fight in 5-mech stars instead of 4-mech lances.
BattleMech Omni design, whereas they still have the ability to swap out designs depending on mission parameters or terrain.
Warships, pretty simple.
Elementals, and advantage over standard infantry
Improved Pilots, not just lower piloting scores, but a built in bonus to initiative, which plays a huge part in battle success.
I think the Clans and their mech designs could still be very fun to play, without the head capping guass rifles, ER ppc and no minimum LRMs. Speeds and weapons would be similar to Inner Sphere designs, allowing for more balanced games.
Just some crazy ideas, what do you all think? Crazy?
_________________
"I have lived my life trying to be a virtuous man. The Dragon admires tenacity, and the code of the samurai upholds it as well." -Minobu Tetsuhara
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Horhiro
Draconis Combine
Samurai
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1625
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Oct-2017 18:53 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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Original Thor
BattleMech Technical Readout
Name/Model: Thor (Summoner) PRIME
Designer: Horhiro
Source(s): Custom Mordel.Net Units
Technology: Clan
Technology Rating: F
Tonnage: 70
Configuration: Biped OmniMech
Era/Year: Early Succession Wars / 2872
Rules (Current): Tournament Legal
Rules (Era): Tournament Legal
Rules (Year): Tournament Legal
Total Cost: 21,150,833 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,298
Structure: Standard
Power Plant: 350 XL
Walking Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 86.4 kph
Jump Jets: Unknown
Jump Capacity: 150 meters
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
1 LRM 15
1 ER PPC
1 LB 10-X AC
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking: Unknown
================================================================================================
Equipment Mass
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard 7.00
Engine: 350 XL 15.00
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 5
Heat Sinks (Double): 14 [28] 4.00
Gyro: Standard 4.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Armor Factor: 182 9.50
Type: Ferro-Fibrous
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 22 27
Center Torso (rear): 8
R/L Torso: 15 22
R/L Torso (rear): 7
R/L Arm: 11 17
R/L Leg: 15 23
================================================================================================
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jump Jet CT 1 1.00
LRM 15 LT 2 3.50
LRM 15 (Ammo 16) LT 2 2.00
ER PPC RA 2 6.00
LB 10-X AC LA 5 10.00
LB 10-X AC (Ammo 10) LA 1 1.00
2 Jump Jets RL 2 2.00
2 Jump Jets LL 2 2.00
_________________
"I have lived my life trying to be a virtuous man. The Dragon admires tenacity, and the code of the samurai upholds it as well." -Minobu Tetsuhara
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Horhiro
Draconis Combine
Samurai
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1625
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Oct-2017 18:55 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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Redesigned 3025 Inner Sphere Tech Version
BattleMech Technical Readout
Name/Model: Summoner 3025 Prime
Designer: Horhiro
Source(s): Custom Mordel.Net Units
Technology: Inner Sphere
Technology Rating: E
Tonnage: 70
Configuration: Biped BattleMech
Era/Year: Late Succession Wars / 3025
Rules (Current): Introductory
Rules (Era): Introductory
Rules (Year): Introductory
Total Cost: 6,073,533 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,391
Structure: Standard
Power Plant: 280 Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 kph
Maximum Speed: 64.8 kph
Jump Jets: Unknown
Jump Capacity: 90 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
1 LRM 10
1 PPC
1 Autocannon/10
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking: Unknown
================================================================================================
Equipment Mass
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard 7.00
Engine: 280 Fusion 16.00
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 3
Heat Sinks (Single): 11 1.00
Gyro: Standard 3.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Armor Factor: 176 11.00
Type: Standard
Internal Armor
Structure Value
Head: 3 9
Center Torso: 22 27
Center Torso (rear): 6
R/L Torso: 15 22
R/L Torso (rear): 5
R/L Arm: 11 17
R/L Leg: 15 23
================================================================================================
Weapons and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jump Jet CT 1 1.00
LRM 10 LT 2 5.00
LRM 10 (Ammo 12) LT 1 1.00
PPC RA 3 7.00
Autocannon/10 LA 7 12.00
Autocannon/10 (Ammo 10) LA 1 1.00
Jump Jet RL 1 1.00
Jump Jet LL 1 1.00
_________________
"I have lived my life trying to be a virtuous man. The Dragon admires tenacity, and the code of the samurai upholds it as well." -Minobu Tetsuhara
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5792
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Oct-2017 02:58 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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What about giving the Clans the Improved Weapons in IO pg. 95-96?
A small advantage over the IS?
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5792
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Oct-2017 03:28 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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| Code: | Thor 3025 Mek
Clan unofficial
70 tons
BV: 1,482
Cost: 8,108,292 C-bills
Movement: 4/6/4
Engine: 280
Heat Sinks: 11
Gyro: Standard Gyro
Internal: 107
Armor: 184/217
Internal Armor
--------------------------------------
Center Torso 22 28
Center Torso (rear) 9
Right Torso 15 20
Right Torso (rear) 6
Left Torso 15 20
Left Torso (rear) 6
Right Arm 11 18
Left Arm 11 18
Right Leg 15 25
Left Leg 15 25
Weapon Loc Heat
----------------------------------------
Improved PPC RA 10
Improved Autocannon/10 LA 3
Improved LRM 15 LT 5
Ammo Loc Shots
----------------------------------------
Improved Autocannon/10 Ammo LA 10
Improved Autocannon/10 Ammo LA 10
Improved LRM 15 Ammo LT 8
Improved LRM 15 Ammo LT 8
!MechView.CarringCapacity!One battle armor squad
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_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 15-Oct-2017 00:37 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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I'd go for AC/5 and LRM 15. It helps to keep the range profile and you could have a full jump.
_________________
The dragon NEVER sleeps!
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Horhiro
Draconis Combine
Samurai
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1625
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2017 08:03 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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Interesting, I didn't even know about those! Further investigation required! Thanks.
_________________
"I have lived my life trying to be a virtuous man. The Dragon admires tenacity, and the code of the samurai upholds it as well." -Minobu Tetsuhara
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Horhiro
Draconis Combine
Samurai
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1625
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2017 08:06 Post subject: Re: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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| Sleeping Dragon wrote: | | I'd go for AC/5 and LRM 15. It helps to keep the range profile and you could have a full jump. |
Good points! I also like the AC5, but I'm thinking a bit more punch with the AC10. Do you think there's a noticeable advantage to jumping 4, rather than 3?
_________________
"I have lived my life trying to be a virtuous man. The Dragon admires tenacity, and the code of the samurai upholds it as well." -Minobu Tetsuhara
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Mordel
Mordel.Net
Administrator
Joined: 03-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 6087
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2017 08:57 Post subject: Re: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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| Horhiro wrote: | | Interesting, I didn't even know about those! Further investigation required! Thanks. |
Yeah, I don't believe I have those programmed into the site yet as they first came out in IO and I haven't put any new IO and I haven't included any new IO stuff.
_________________
Mordel Blacknight - Site Administrator
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2017 19:18 Post subject: Re: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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Well, it allows you to move between covers further away and reach lvl 4 hills from lvl 0. It's situational, but it's nice to have ocassionally. I'd actually save the AC/10 for Summoner A.
Here are the configurations as I'd see them - maybe it could go with 12 fixed SHSs. I've tried to have the guns with easily manageable heat profile. There are two D configurations below. First is the direct transcription, the second is a bit of a stretch, but it would keep more with the sniping nature of the canon Summoner D
Base 45 tons (4 JJs, 1 SHS) 25 tons of pod space
Prime (Overheat 4 LRM + 1 AC + 10 PPC + 4 Jump - 13 Dissipation = 6 / 4 while running)
LRM-10 + 2 tons of ammo 7 tons
AC/5 + 1 ton of ammo 9 tons
PPC 7 tons
2 SHS 2 tons
A (Overheat 3 AC + 3 SRM + 8 LL + 4 jump - 14 dissipation = 18 / 2 while running)
AC/10 + 2 tons of ammo 14 tons
SRM-4 + 1 ton of ammo 3 tons
Large laser 5 tons
3 SHS 3 tons
B (Overheat 10 LRM + 6 SRM + 4 jump - 13 dissipation = 7 / 5 while running - bad numbers, but easily handled with bracket firing then it's 1 for LRMs while jumping and -3 for SRMs)
2 LRM-15 + 4 tons of ammo 18 tons
2 SRM-4 + 2 tons of ammo 6 tons
1 Machine gun + 1 ton of ammo 1 ton
2 SHS
C (Overheat 7 AC + 8 LL + 3 SRM + 4 Jump - 12 Dissipation = 10 / 8 while running. That's a lot, but LL is more of a token ranged weapon to be used before you run in AC and SRM range. Without it you are golden, or you can alter it with ease with the AC when the shots would be too dicey. Again easy to ride the heat)
AC/20 + 2 tons of ammo 16 tons
Large laser 5 tons
SRM-4 + 1 ton of ammo 3 tons
1 SHS 1 ton
D (Overheat 16 LLs + 6 MLs + 4 Jump - 22 Dissipation = 4 / 2 while running)
2 large lasers 10 tons
2 Medium lasers 2 tons
3 Machine guns + 0.5 tons of ammo 2 tons
11 SHS 11 tons
D Alternative (Overheat 20 PPCs + 6 MLs + 4 Jump - 19 Dissipation = 11 / 9 while running. Tricky (well, snicker, not THAT tricky) even while bracket firing at 5 / 3 heat without MLs, but manageable)
2 PPCs 14 tons
2 Medium lasers 2 tons
1 Machine gun + 0.5 tons of ammo 1 ton
8 SHS 8 tons
_________________
The dragon NEVER sleeps!
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5792
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2017 21:47 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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Quick List
IAC/2 1H 2D 4/8/16/24 45A 5T 1C
IAC/5 1H 5D 3/6/12/18 20A 7T 2C
IAC/10 3H 10D 0/5/10/15 10A 11T 6C
IAC/20 7H 20D 0/3/6/9 5A 13T 9C
ILL 8H 8D 0/5/10/15 - 4T 1C
IPPC 10H 10D 3/6/12/18 - 6T 2C
ILRM/5 2H 1D/M 6/7/14/21 24A 1T 1C
ILRM/10 4H 1D/M 6/7/14/21 12A 2.5T 1C
ILRM/15 5H 1D/M 6/7/14/21 8A 3.5T 2C
ILRM/20 6H 1D/M 6/7/14/21 6A 5T 4C
ISRM/2 2H 2D/M 0/4/8/12 50A 1T 1C
ISRM/4 3H 2D/M 0/4/8/12 25A 2T 1C
ISRM/6 4H 2D/M 0/4/8/12 15A 3T 2C
Also available but not in your concept:
IGauss 1H 15D 2/7/15/22 8A 13T 6C
ILPL 10H 9D 0/3/6/9 - 6T 2C
EPPC 15H 12D 0/7/14/23 - 7T 3C
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5792
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2017 22:20 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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I know you said you disliked DHS, but what if your theoretical Clans had the DHS-P on IO pg. 71:
| wrote: | Construction Rules: Prototype double heat sinks (DHS-Ps) occupy
the same weight and critical slot space as their production-grade
Inner Sphere versions, but cannot be mounted “inside” an engine.
(This means that all of the “critical-free” heat sinks provided by the
’Mech’s engine, per the rules found on p. 53 of TechManual, must
either be standard heat sinks, or must be fully allocated on the unit’s Critical Hit Table to be replaced with prototype double heat sinks.)
On units that can mount double heat sinks, DHS-Ps can be
combined with standard heat sinks, but the different sinks must
be clearly marked on the record sheet. |
You could easily declare that NONE of the free 10 HS can be DHS-P, thus only Mech's that dedicate weight to HS can get the boost OR that none of the free HS that can be engine mounted can be DHS thus allowing Light Mechs to get a few DHS-P at no weight but stopping larger units.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5792
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Oct-2017 22:21 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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I do wonder, will your 3025 Clan have CASE?
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 17-Oct-2017 00:40 Post subject: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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Aren't there any early clan technologies in the Golden Century sourcebook (I didn't read that one yet.)
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Horhiro
Draconis Combine
Samurai
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1625
Location: United States
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| Posted: 18-Oct-2017 18:37 Post subject: Re: The Clans: 3025 Inner Sphere Tech? |
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| Vagabond wrote: | | I do wonder, will your 3025 Clan have CASE? |
I'm leaning towards no case. IMHO the beauty of an ammo explosion, is that except late in the game its pretty much a mech killer. I've always liked the idea that if your going to carry ammo weapons then you've gotta take that chance. I cry foul when someone comes to battle with no MG ammo!
Of course that's one of my peeves with the clan mechs as designed. Only 2 xl engine slots in the torso, so even if you get that ammo/guass explosion it doesn't put them down. Great for campaigns but not as much fun for me in battles.
Still thinking just single heat sinks, so as to force on players the tactics of heat management.
_________________
"I have lived my life trying to be a virtuous man. The Dragon admires tenacity, and the code of the samurai upholds it as well." -Minobu Tetsuhara
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