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ICER
Clan Hell's Horses
Galaxy Commander
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1663
Location: United States
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 Posted: 05-Oct-2003 22:55 Post subject: Ok, chihawk |
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Here's a weird thing for you to investigate. I found this little post at another board. And it raised some eyebrows. So I thought I would give it to you to de-bunk it
“A real time traveler from the year 2036. This is really interesting and makes you wonder about some things. He even gave hints to the events of 9-11 before it happened. He also talked about a new civil war starting soon, a little too soon for me. Do you think he's for real? http://www.johntitor.com/”
It's a cute little story. But could it possible be true?
I say no. Because time travel is possible. But only forwards, not backwards (If I remember my Einstein correctly)
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Raven!
Clan Snow Raven
Galaxy Commander
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Oct-2003 00:19 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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I would hope to God (myself) that this question would not even need to be asked. if you had the power to travel back in time why would you even bother? I mean the power necessary would make nuclear bombs look like lighting farts at the bar.
Raven!
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Stinger
The Knights of Chaos
General
Joined: 30-Apr-2002 00:00
Posts: 1833
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Oct-2003 01:37 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Cant get the URL to work..
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Stinger
If it's "creepy" to use the Internet, military satellites, and robot aircraft to find a house full of gorgeous young models so I can drop in on them unexpected, then FINE, I'm "creepy". Howard Wolowitz. BBT.
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Slythis
Federated Suns
Colonel
Joined: 09-Aug-2002 00:00
Posts: 712
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| Posted: 06-Oct-2003 02:10 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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not exactly, if time travel backwards is possible then you can't change anything anyway, backcause anything you change was what happened in history, I mean how do we know that if people weren't going back in time then man kind never would've had gotten this far and that the bad things that have happened were designed to keep things stable...
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Stinger
The Knights of Chaos
General
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Oct-2003 03:15 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Wellthe other thing youd have happening is people going back and trying to change somethings for the better (How different would the world be if JFK was never assissinated) or even the fanaticle going back and helping someone that should never get the help (how different would the world be if someone gave Hitlers generals all the troop movements for the allies before they made them).
I know the Therory is you cant travel back in time, but as it is a therory we have to realize that anything is possible.
Just very unlikely.
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Stinger
If it's "creepy" to use the Internet, military satellites, and robot aircraft to find a house full of gorgeous young models so I can drop in on them unexpected, then FINE, I'm "creepy". Howard Wolowitz. BBT.
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8072
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Oct-2003 06:08 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Anything is possible, I'd rate that as "very unlikely".
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Daphne Wilde
Star League Defense Force
Lieutenant Colonel
Joined: 19-Sep-2003 00:00
Posts: 425
Location: United States
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| Posted: 06-Oct-2003 17:12 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Nothing Is impossiable( Or Sacred ) and if it is I can fix it. 
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Lt.Col.Daphne Wilde
504 Para. 82 Div.
Io
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Gunslinger Patch
Royal Black Watch Regiment
Major
Joined: 04-Mar-2002 00:00
Posts: 1611
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| Posted: 07-Oct-2003 04:47 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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I could see traveling back in time, but not to change the past.
With this Titor guy, if he came back in time and prevented his war, his life would have been all different and he most likely never would have become a time traveller to begin with.
I thought about this stuff once as a sci-fi plot. I came to think of time as a river with infinite branches. You can travel into the past and change something, but your own past, the path of you own river, stays the same. What you did was create a new river branch and down that branch is where things will be different.
But as I said, that does nothing to change your own past, it only creates an alternate world/universe where someone else's/your other self's future will be different than the event you've lived through yourself.
Of course, since you changed something and saw it change, there is the question of whether you are stuck with this new branch you made. You can move back, or forward on it. But can you ever get back to where you first came from on that original branch? After all, the branches are infinite, how can your time machine know which one is home?
[ This Message was edited by: Gunslinger Patch on 2003-10-07 04:50 ]
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Sir Henry
Team Bansai
Senior Tech Specialist
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4899
Location: United States
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| Posted: 07-Oct-2003 07:31 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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I'd go just to watch the events happen.
I don't think I could go back and just watch, I'd change something and wreck everything...
So I'll just watch, like on TV....
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Sir Henry
A Dragon in the disguise of a bunny, is still a Dragon.
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Gunslinger Patch
Royal Black Watch Regiment
Major
Joined: 04-Mar-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 08-Oct-2003 02:46 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Well, there's the question of what would really change things too. Say I went back a couple of years and dropped by my house right after I went to work and played Ultima online till just before I got home from work and then split, leaving myself wondering when I made that 50,000 extra gold pieces. Does that matter? Did it create a new timeline? And how can I go back and do this thing I don't recall happening in my own memory and have it still be in my personal past? Unless it was something I simply forgot about, wouldn't that have mad that all new branch of time right there?
Or does it take something more substantial, such as going back somewhere and preventing a man and woman from meeting by chance, who would otherwise have got married and had a kid if not for you messing with time?
And of course the time honored change that somewhere along the line caused you not to be born? So if you were not born, how did you go back and do the thing that made you not be born?
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"Those who beat their guns into plows will plow for those with guns..." -Thomas Jefferson
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Daphne Wilde
Star League Defense Force
Lieutenant Colonel
Joined: 19-Sep-2003 00:00
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 08-Oct-2003 02:50 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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BoB made it so........
-cDc-
? & ?
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Lt.Col.Daphne Wilde
504 Para. 82 Div.
Io
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Gunslinger Patch
Royal Black Watch Regiment
Major
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Posts: 1611
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| Posted: 08-Oct-2003 02:57 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Oh, yeah. If I could go back in time, aside from picking up a really nice winning lottery ticket for as much as possible (they are good for 180 days after purchase here in Texas) I would go back to see events.
Stuff like being in Berlin and being in the crowd to hear Reagan say "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!"
Or seeing the first performance of the musical Man of La Mancha. Or seeing Fleetwood Mac in concert before they broke up. Or hell, finding a good costume and going way back to watch Mozart's first performance of Marriage of Figaro.... with a very carefully disguised video camera.
If time travel ever did become real, I think the historians of all sorts should have first dibs. Imagine filling our history books with pictures and video footage of past famous people. Color photos of Saladin and King RIchard II during the crusades. Or footage of George Washington reading his famous letter to his assembled officers after they have just called on him to be the King of America. "Forgive me, but my eyes have grown weak in the service of my country."
Stuff like that would be pretty neat if it could be done with changing anything.
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"Those who beat their guns into plows will plow for those with guns..." -Thomas Jefferson
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 08-Oct-2003 13:47 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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I remember a Nova Special on PBS discussing time travel. It is theoretically possible, but to get the energy to do it would involve harnesing the power output of a couple quasars.
On the science fiction side, FTL drive will almost have to manipulate time in some fashion. It would probably be simply to do a Time jump instead of a Space jump. I would use that as factor for misjumps, if I could find a consisant logic about when a time crash rather than a space crash happens. Mater of fact I remember reading a truly old sci-fi book talking about drive malfunctions and "time crashing"
There is an old sci-fi book written by someone by the name of Hogan "Doomsday Machine" or such. He seemed to explain most phsics away as spin and wave that function in several dimensions. Intersections cause things to manifest in 3d space (ours) for no apparent reason, or skip in and out. Learn how to manipulate the right functions and you appear to go from here to there NOW, and violate no natural laws doing it in no time and no distance.
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Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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Daphne Wilde
Star League Defense Force
Lieutenant Colonel
Joined: 19-Sep-2003 00:00
Posts: 425
Location: United States
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| Posted: 08-Oct-2003 16:52 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Interesting piece of info: seems 'ole albert wasn't compleatly right, new study I read proves that the speed of light is not a constant but variable. there for E=Mc2 is no longer an absolute. soooooooooooo........ now what?  
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Lt.Col.Daphne Wilde
504 Para. 82 Div.
Io
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Gunslinger Patch
Royal Black Watch Regiment
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Joined: 04-Mar-2002 00:00
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| Posted: 09-Oct-2003 00:27 Post subject: RE: Ok, chihawk |
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Heh, I used to have a couple of books on tape I listened to at work called Time and Again, I think. They had a pretty neat way to time travel.
In these books, traveling in time needed no machine, just a person with the right sort of mind and the right surroundings. The traveller found a place that was virtually the same in the present as it was in the time he wished to go to. He wore period clothes, period fabrics, money, watches, shoes, etc. And then he just sat there a while and meditated on it and he would slip into the past or return to the present.
In the first book the main character is recruited for this project. They know the past has been changed because here and there things have survived that prove this. Stuff like old newspapers with pics of the Titanic coming into New York harbor at the end of her maiden voyage, or old campaign buttons with the wrong running mate on them. So this guy finds out he can do this and goes back to 1880s New York and sees his ancenstors do their vaudeville act. Then he finds his woman and decides to stay there and raise a family. So do the other travellers apparently as he is the only one who returns, if only to say he is quitting the project.
In the second book the guy is starting to think that maybe he should prevent WWI since his son will no doubt be shot at in that war and returns to the present. He finds a soldier who was with the old project and is talked into trying to prevent WWI by stopping a man with vital letters from going down with the Titanic.
The man with the letters is an officer and honorable, a lot of well bred men went down with that ship rather than try to rush the lifeboats and fight to live. So the traveller and a female traveller he meets up with try to slightly alter the ship's course just a little bit, so it will miss the iceberg. After which the ship hits the iceberg, something that would not have happened had they not made it happen. They survive, since they knew which lifeboat was launched mostly empty.
I wish I could recall the author. As I recall istwas a pretty engaging story to listen to.
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"Those who beat their guns into plows will plow for those with guns..." -Thomas Jefferson
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