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bandit
Clan Nova Cat
Star Colonel
Joined: 21-Sep-2002 00:00
Posts: 497
Location: Italy
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 Posted: 28-Jul-2013 01:00 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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Hello forum members.
I would need your own opinion.
I have access to 10,000 BV to create a Liao force.
I'll give you a list of available units.
The limitation is due to the miniatures available
and recordsheets (unfortunately my old PC is out of order and at the moment I can only have the versions that are listed).
Other parameters are as follow:
minimum 5 units
maximum of 10 units
1 only double
rules of level 2.
Here the available units with BV
the asterisk show that mechs with stealth armor.
and the type of engine
STG-6L Stinger 478 * ST
STG-6L Stinger 478 * ST
WSP-3L Wasp 610 * ST
D9-J9 Duan Gung 737 XL
EGL-2M Eagle 800 ST
RVN-4L Raven 873 *XL
RVN-4L Raven 873 *XL
ZPH-1A Tarantula 666 XL
ZPH-1A Tarantula 666 XL
JA-KL-1532 Jackal 918 XL
JA-KL-1532 Jackal 918 XL
SDR-9K Venom 798 XL
SYU-2B Sha Yu 1488 *XL or
SYU-4B Sha Yu 1348 *XL
PXH-4L Phoenix Hawk 1399 *ST
SNK-1V Snake 980 XL
VND-4L Vindicator 1493 *XL
VND-5L Vindicator 1467 ST
HUR-R4L Huron Warrior 1530 XL or
HUR-R4M Huron Warrior 1556 XL
OSR-4L Ostroc 1832 *ST
TSG-9H Ti Ts'ang 1841 XL
CRD-7L Crusader 1860 *ST
JN-G8A Jinggau 2072 XL
THR-1L Thunder 1471 XL
THR-1L Thunder 1471 XL
CTF-4L Cataphract 2037 *ST
LHU-2B Lao Hu 1771 XL
Y-H9G Yu Huang 2074 XL
PLG-3Z Pillager 2868 XL or
PLG-4Z Pillager 2697 *ST
You may also include some support vehicles and infantry
lrm carrier 833
srm carrier 813
Schrek ppc carrier 935
Main Gauche 464
Main Gauche 464
Fa-Shih Battle Armor las/fla/MG
Any kind of standard infantry
Thanks in advance for your help
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5788
Location: United States
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| Posted: 28-Jul-2013 03:33 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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my advise... download Megamek, create a force there. You can then generate a generic AI force and test it. See if it feels right.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 28-Jul-2013 10:34 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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The computer games are not the board games. I say that because your opponent isn't going to do logical math based thinking, when you play against someone in real life face to face.
I suggest using the HMPRO and use the force selector there and see what it gives you or the Random mech generator tables for Laio and go from there since those tables are suppose to be a balanced etc...
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5788
Location: United States
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| Posted: 29-Jul-2013 00:40 Post subject: Re: Looking for advice |
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| Karagin wrote: | The computer games are not the board games. I say that because your opponent isn't going to do logical math based thinking, when you play against someone in real life face to face.
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I disagree. Megamek as I said in another post is an electronic version of the board game. And yes, the AI will not play like a human opponent. However, it is not difficult to simply find a human opponent to play a MM game with you to test your force. I do it all the time.
However, the AI can give you enough of a feel to judge the cohesiveness of a force. It gives you gears on the ground like a flight simulator would for a soldier. I've had forces that on paper seemed grand for my BV options that fell apart once I put them on the virtual board.
It is a tool available.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 29-Jul-2013 05:33 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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Neither of the MMOs are official games sanctioned by CGL. It may be a tool, but one I know many who would not allow you to use.
_________________
Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5788
Location: United States
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| Posted: 29-Jul-2013 12:49 Post subject: Re: Looking for advice |
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| Karagin wrote: | | Neither of the MMOs are official games sanctioned by CGL. It may be a tool, but one I know many who would not allow you to use. |
MMOs? Are you referring to Megamek and Mekwars? Cause if so you confused me with the MASSIVE part of MMO; if not, what are you referring too?
Um. How would anyone know you used whatever you used to construct a force unless you told them? I could make and test a force in MM and then simply write the chosen units down on a piece of paper or if you need to bring your own record sheets, print them out (either HMPro or SSW).
I'm not saying he bring a laptop to the table. I'm saying he could use MM to run a series of sims to see what mix of units is best for him. In this same way, I found that I liked using the two man team of a DV-6M and WTH-1. Never liked them before a series of games in MM.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 29-Jul-2013 19:06 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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And I am saying stay with the official tables and charts and use them since they are there for just what he needs.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5788
Location: United States
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| Posted: 29-Jul-2013 22:51 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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And I'm saying he has a list made from official lists and tables. He is asking for which specific units to use and add to his force for the BV budget given. I am saying he could easily use MM to assemble and test that force. He doesn't need any official tables; hes already done this step.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 30-Jul-2013 05:26 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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And I am saying that MM doesn't give you a true showing of what the force can do, which he would be better off using the tables and tweaking with what he wants or running a small game or two of the board game and getting an idea of what works that way. You are forgetting that MM takes away a lot variables when it has the computer doing the work for you, there is no human error factor or human emotion factor that makes the face to face board game battle enjoyable.
Did I mean to move into those woods, damn it now I am out flanked and crap his tanks are now in position to maul the Hermes. Crap. Wait I have two Rifleman on the ridge...all leading up to one side or the other making a mistake and the fight and dice rolls...could go either way. Some folks are good at dice rolling others have no luck with them at all, something that is lost with the computer game. So while you can defend MM till the cows come home, I am still going to be in favor of face to face BT game.
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Mordel
Mordel.Net
Administrator
Joined: 03-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 6085
Location: United States
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| Posted: 30-Jul-2013 10:04 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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At the end of the day you're both right here.
Vagabond is right because MegaMek is a perfectly viable tool to use and play a game with, be it against the UI or against another random opponent you've never met.
Karagin is right in that you don't get that face to face experience with MM, so to him you miss out on a big part of what makes the game enjoyable.
Neither of you are wrong, and you're both only expressing facts at this point.
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Mordel Blacknight - Site Administrator
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Sleeping Dragon
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 06-Apr-2005 00:00
Posts: 4820
Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 30-Jul-2013 14:00 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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Got to agree that MM is a good thing if you just want to see what the force feels like before you get to actual game.
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The dragon NEVER sleeps!
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5788
Location: United States
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| Posted: 30-Jul-2013 22:02 Post subject: Re: Looking for advice |
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| Karagin wrote: | | So while you can defend MM till the cows come home, I am still going to be in favor of face to face BT game. |
And you have every right to feel that way. I prefer the F2F BT for simple games. Once you add aeroes and certain optional rules then i'd rather play on the computer do to how much time they add in F2F games. I am not saying now nor did I say earlier that anyone should use either over another or use a system they don't favor. Use the method that best fits your needs.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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bandit
Clan Nova Cat
Star Colonel
Joined: 21-Sep-2002 00:00
Posts: 497
Location: Italy
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| Posted: 31-Jul-2013 03:28 Post subject: Looking for advice |
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I solved the problem by including design by TRO3085.
I get exactly 9997 points.
Here the final choice:
light lance+BA
WSP-8T Wasp 439
STG-6L Stinger 478
STG-6L Stinger 478
D9-J9 Duan Gung 737
Fa Shih fla 197
Fa Shih las 229
Heavy lance
LRM carrier 833
CRD-8L Crusader 1701
CTF-4L Cataphract 2037
PLG-4Z Pillager 2868
Thanks anyway for you advice but I'm soooo ignorant with megamek,that I feel ashame
You know ,I'm a big fan of Battletech since 1992,but I never had a chance to play with MM in my life.
I' don't know why ,but for me it looks too much complicated and so this keep me far from start to play.
But soon or later I will try once in my life ,just I'm afraid to became addicted. 
PS
let me know what do you think about my deployed units.
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5788
Location: United States
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| Posted: 31-Jul-2013 13:45 Post subject: Re: Looking for advice |
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| bandit wrote: |
STG-6L Stinger 478
STG-6L Stinger 478
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Are you sure the 6L is 478? I'm seeing the 6L at 680 and the 6S at 478.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5788
Location: United States
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| Posted: 31-Jul-2013 14:06 Post subject: Re: Looking for advice |
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Maybe try this:
BA Lance
Fa Shih fla 201
Fa Shih fla 201
Fa Shih las 233
Fa Shih MG 201
light lance
WSP-8T Wasp 439
STG-6L Stinger 680
STG-6L Stinger 680
D9-J9 Duan Gung 737
Heavy lance
LRM carrier 833
CRD-8L Crusader 1701
CTF-4L Cataphract 2037
Y-H9G Yu Huang 2074
Total= 9982 BV.
Use the mag clamps on the Fah Shih to have the light lance deploy them as if they were omni-mechs. Going with the Yu Huang rather than the Pillager frees up the BV to correct the Stinger BV and get two extra BA.
Note: The Fa Shih also have a anti-personnel weapons mount that can have a infantry weapon for the BV difference above. I most often see the Auto-Rifle used as above.
_________________
one must work hard to cultivate the mind and body. and one must always cultivate the mind.
//^(^_^)^\\
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