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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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 Posted: 03-May-2019 19:56 Post subject: Battletech Question |
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Okay I just left a local game store, new one in my area, and after hearing this conversation I am a bit baffled and confused at how some folks act about things.
Guy was there demoing Battletech, he had eight mechs, aka lance on lance, and had about 6 folks learning the game, so far so go. I was very happy to see this happening, hell most folks in the area are either WH40K or one of the card game players.
So as I am buying the comics and paints, I hear these two guys talking, note they are watching NOT playing, and their biggest beef was that the guy running things had a mech that wasn't an official mech on the table, and some how this was like a flogging offense to these two and their reason, because it's not how the game should is played. So I ask out curiosity, how having a "home made" mech is not how the game is played?
Their answer was only official mechs are allowed in demo games. So I asked them are you Commandos (or what ever CGL calls their group) or affiliated with CGL in any shape or form? They said no, but then go on tell me it's in the rules. So hearing that, and I freely admit some of the new rules I am not up to speed on, and many of the new "toys" and such I don't agree with, I watch the demo game for about 25 minutes.
Yes the guy running the game was using a home made mech, a mere 20 ton mech that has two small lasers a MG and a SRM2. Here is the part the two missed, ALL of the players were using 40 tons or heavier mechs. Break down of the other mechs, three Chameleons (Oh gee, the original mech to learn the game with, gosh), a Vindicator, and two Panthers and he had a Wasp in case of eight people wanted to play. His mech was there so he could play and teach. So after watching the game and not seeing any thing that was crazy or not following the rules, I left. They were having fun and thus to me that is what matters, hope we see more of this locally.
Now my question(s) is did the rules change? Is it stated that you must use book aka official mechs for demo games?
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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Ruger
Lyran Alliance
Hauptmann General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 2105
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| Posted: 03-May-2019 20:34 Post subject: Battletech Question |
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It is my understanding that if you are an official Demo agent doing an official demo, then you have to use official designs, and it's preferable to use official minis, but I might be off on this. If this was not an official demo agent running an official demonstration, anything goes.
Ruger
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Karagin
Imperial Karagin Army
Imperial General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4120
Location: United States
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| Posted: 03-May-2019 21:16 Post subject: Re: Battletech Question |
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| Ruger wrote: | It is my understanding that if you are an official Demo agent doing an official demo, then you have to use official designs, and it's preferable to use official minis, but I might be off on this. If this was not an official demo agent running an official demonstration, anything goes.
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That's what I thought, given that none of the folks at the store are official anything...
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Karagin
Only the dead have seen the end of war. - Plato
"Wasted trip Man. Nobody said nuthin' about lockin' horns with no tigers." Oddball
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8081
Location: United States
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| Posted: 03-May-2019 22:02 Post subject: Battletech Question |
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I would have told the two people that were watching that they need to move out of their parent's basement and join the real world...
...and I'm not joking. I absolutely would have told them that.
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 5793
Location: United States
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| Posted: 04-May-2019 11:51 Post subject: Re: Battletech Question |
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| chihawk wrote: | I would have told the two people that were watching that they need to move out of their parent's basement and join the real world...
...and I'm not joking. I absolutely would have told them that. |
Yah, I read your facebook enough to verify that.
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Jade_Dragon
8th Sword of Light
Sho-sho
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1326
Location: United States
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| Posted: 11-May-2019 20:56 Post subject: Battletech Question |
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One of the best things about BattleTech has always been the ability to do custom Mechs. Taking a custom 20 tonner against stock 40s and 50s, now that is the way to teach the game.
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The JadeDragon
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NekoGin2285
Clan Coyote
Warrior
Joined: 15-Oct-2019 18:52
Posts: 2
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| Posted: 15-Oct-2019 20:56 Post subject: Battletech Question |
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I second this sentiment.
I have been playing for ... a really long long time - more than two decades and as soon as I saw the equipment chart I had modified the mech I was using out of the original box set -
I mean we had this:
LCT-1V Locust
STG-3R Stinger
WSP-1A Wasp
PXH-1 Phoenix Hawk
TRC-4B Chameleon (no stand-up playing piece provided; generic training 'Mech)
GRF-1N Griffin
SHD-2H Shadow Hawk
WVR-6R Wolverine
MLN-1A Merlin (no stand-up playing piece provided; used as a practical example for the construction rules)
RFL-3N Rifleman
CRD-6R Crusader
TDR-5S Thunderbolt
ARC-2R Archer
WHM-6R Warhammer
MAD-3R Marauder
BLR-1G BattleMaster
and you note that the Merlin is listed purely for construction rules education... seems ridiculous that these people would behave that way. If no body in the demo game has a problem with it then it shows the newbies more aspects of the game and that they do not have to stick with the stock anything and that they will be able to develop a style and have or make the designs to accommodate that style.
I second the tell them to get a place of their own comment...
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Sir Henry
Team Bansai
Senior Tech Specialist
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4899
Location: United States
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| Posted: 18-Oct-2019 19:51 Post subject: Battletech Question |
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I learned on the Wolverine.
...
...
Over 20 years ago.
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Sir Henry
A Dragon in the disguise of a bunny, is still a Dragon.
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MAD-4A
Federated Suns
Private
Joined: 26-Apr-2020 01:03
Posts: 20
Location: United States
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| Posted: 26-Apr-2020 22:45 Post subject: Re: Battletech Question |
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| Jade_Dragon wrote: | | One of the best things about BattleTech has always been the ability to do custom Mechs. Taking a custom 20 tonner against stock 40s and 50s, now that is the way to teach the game. |
That was a beef I have always had! The construction rules were – as the name suggests – part of the rules, always has been, I have it in the rules book from … oh Panther … long ago, yet they never let you use them in “official” games. They are “official” rules are they not?
Sure the GM can use them if he wants to. It’s his game.
One of the beefs I have with WHM is they have set ‘official’ units and you can only use what they currently say is official. So what? I spend $100s of dollars on minis from them and then they tell me “oh those aren’t official anymore so you can’t use them!” – YOU SOLD THEM TO ME, BUY THEM BACK!
bty when I bought the first rules compendium – which had the construction rules in it – I stopped using the original book for the most part. When I latter saw the Merlin, in a readout after many more rules books came out and I had no need for the examples, I had no idea where it was from, never noticed it was the construction example in the original book – I learned something new about the game today, thanks – never to late!!!
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MAD-4A
Federated Suns
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Joined: 26-Apr-2020 01:03
Posts: 20
Location: United States
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| Posted: 26-Apr-2020 22:49 Post subject: Re: Battletech Question |
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| Sir Henry wrote: | I learned on the Wolverine.
...
...
Over 20 years ago. |
Solo between a Warhammer and Crusader. Now that I think about it - I was a real newbie the Crusader won. 
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8081
Location: United States
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| Posted: 27-Apr-2020 08:44 Post subject: Re: Battletech Question |
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| MAD-4A wrote: | | Jade_Dragon wrote: | | One of the best things about BattleTech has always been the ability to do custom Mechs. Taking a custom 20 tonner against stock 40s and 50s, now that is the way to teach the game. |
That was a beef I have always had! The construction rules were – as the name suggests – part of the rules, always has been, I have it in the rules book from … oh Panther … long ago, yet they never let you use them in “official” games. They are “official” rules are they not?
Sure the GM can use them if he wants to. It’s his game.
One of the beefs I have with WHM is they have set ‘official’ units and you can only use what they currently say is official. So what? I spend $100s of dollars on minis from them and then they tell me “oh those aren’t official anymore so you can’t use them!” – YOU SOLD THEM TO ME, BUY THEM BACK!
bty when I bought the first rules compendium – which had the construction rules in it – I stopped using the original book for the most part. When I latter saw the Merlin, in a readout after many more rules books came out and I had no need for the examples, I had no idea where it was from, never noticed it was the construction example in the original book – I learned something new about the game today, thanks – never to late!!! |
I thought the rule was the older sculps were still official...
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MAD-4A
Federated Suns
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Joined: 26-Apr-2020 01:03
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 27-Apr-2020 12:25 Post subject: Re: Battletech Question |
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| chihawk wrote: |
I thought the rule was the older sculps were still official... |
In BT (except for the 'unseen' period which I believe is over - I ignored anyway) but not is WHM as far as I know, which is why I never bought any minis (except maybe 2 but I'm not sure got them somewhere else but look like they may be?) and never got into it, too simplistic, just a bunch of D6 throwing with no real details (like AlfStk).
I did like the 10mm Warmaster though, got pretty good with the Orcs despite having no real ranged attacks. Most people put the Goblins up front as cheap fodder (15pt one of the cheapest units in the game), where they get killed and count towards losses against moral, I put them to the rear so they don't get killed and count for my moral (if you loose a certain % of your # of units, your army breaks and runs - you loose) so if you loose 10 goblin units and your trolls and elite Black Orcs haven't engaged - well they run, but if you engage with your trolls and Black Orcs with 10 Goblin units bringing up the rear then the enemy has to take out your big guys first before your fodder runs. In BT terms - if the scenario said you have a company of 12 mechs - if your down to a lance of 4 you loose. if you rush in your lance of Stingers and Urbies first then attack with your Heavy and Mediums, yea the cheap units absorbed some attacks but now I only need to take out your Medium lance and your Heavies run away, where if I hold my lights to the rear you have to kill all of my Medium and Heavies and (if so) my lights run away.
Plus the Orcs Champion was a 150pt Giant. if you failed a command roll (even the 1st one) you had to roll for what he does (random Giant out-of-control chart) and one of the things he can do is walk full (20cm) towards the nearest edge, and leave if he makes it there. Deployment is 20cm so first command attempt - fail - walk away - oww, so I put a 15 pt goblin unit right behind him so if he did he would stop and engage it (if he contacted any unit while doing this movement he stops and attacks it). what are the odds? well it did happen and my Goblins did prevent me from loosing a Giant once. btw my 8 dice giant rolled lousy at 2 hits and my goblins rolled good at 2 hits so they "bounced" did no damage to either  attacks end on a "bounce" and the Goblins were still there for the next turn which I succeeded and got him going finally. No Goblin past between his toes that I was expecting.
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