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Motown Scrapper
Clan Ice Hellions
Galaxy Commander
Joined: 24-Jul-2003 00:00
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Location: United States
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 Posted: 02-Jun-2004 21:43 Post subject: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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The PM ruled that vehicles only get one type of ammo per weapon. So your LBX, regular AC, Narc, Arrow IV, ATMs, SRMs, & LRMs get no choice. I disagree with that ruling.
I was wanting to do a poll of players to see what you think
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
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| Posted: 02-Jun-2004 21:52 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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that makes as much sense as sun glasses in a cave.
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 02-Jun-2004 23:34 Post subject: Yes |
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Yes, this ruling is stupid. I see no justification for it.
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Stinger
The Knights of Chaos
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 00:20 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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Hmm I couldnt disagree with that ruling more.
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Stinger
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DarkAdder
Clan Star Adder
Star Commander
Joined: 10-Jan-2004 00:00
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 00:31 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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My only question on this one would be, what reason would there be for exotic ordinance to not work on vehicle weapons?
From what Ive understood of the game, an LBX is an LBX is an LBX. If a weapon is damaged or destroyed on a mech, you could pull an identical one from a scrapped vehicle and work with that one.
I can see why Quartermasters would be hesitant to use exotic ammo in vehicles. From what Ive seen, both from the Hits Table and in combat, vehicles have a nasty tendancy to give out after a couple of solid hits. So why waste the pricy, exotic stuff on a machine that may or may not live longer than 20 seconds?
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Blasty McNasty
Free Worlds League
Corporal
Joined: 06-Jan-2004 00:00
Posts: 65
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 00:32 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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You know were I stand.
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 05:06 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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As I have noted in 2 other places, Randall's ruling is consistent with the rules as written.
A weapon and its ammo is considered one piece of equipment for a vehicle--meaning a weapon's ammo is in one big ammo bin. And you can't have multiple ammo types in a bin.
Mechs separate ammo into ammo slots, vehicles don't--hence the ruling follows the rules as written.
And you need not apply real world logic to this, we've all seen that don't matter in Battletech. You also don't need to mention fluff, there are already tons of places where the fluff of a mech is contrary to the rules.
[ This Message was edited by: chihawk on 2004-06-03 05:06 ]
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Kiris65
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 17-Dec-2003 00:00
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Location: Panama
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 07:33 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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A weapon and its ammo is considered one piece of equipment for a vehicle--meaning a weapon's ammo is in one big ammo bin. And you can't have multiple ammo types in a bin.
Mechs separate ammo into ammo slots, vehicles don't--hence the ruling follows the rules as written.
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Chi' I would agree with your statement except fot the fact that modern tanks like the M1A1 can carry and fire both HEAT and APFSDS rounds.
The space inside the tanks are dependant on the size of ammo.
According to the TRO manuals how many rounds of ammo can a Rommel, Patton or Bulldog carry? Believe it is consistent with todays tanks.
True that in most of todays tanks ammo is loaded manualy (western tanks mostly), Russian tanks (correct me if am wrong) since the T-62 series have automatic loaders that can differentiate the bins from which the ammo is taken from.
So the rule for me doesn't seem logical, however since BT is flexible enough, one can change these rule with your own House rules, provided you announce it prior beginning of play.
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Oafman
Draconis Combine
Tai-sho
Joined: 18-Nov-2003 00:00
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 09:21 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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I would have to agree with the general sentiment here. If mechs are able to have separate bins for the ammo, then there is no logical reason why tanks are not able to. The same technology is available to both. Like everything else though, if you do not like the new ruling, then you do not have to use it at home. This odd ruling really does not affect people like me that never play at conventions.
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Mordel
Mordel.Net
Administrator
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 11:33 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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As chihawk said, don't apply real world rules and logic. This is FASA physics remember. And because ammo and the equipment are considered stored in the same location, then I'd agree with Randall's ruling. Now, if you were to add critical slots to a vehicle, like a 'mech has, then I would say you could split it up.
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-Mud
ex-Jade Falcon
Bounty Hunter
Joined: 04-Nov-2003 00:00
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 13:17 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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For an official tournament, they're constrained by the rules as they are written. For a little throw-down though, I wouldn't get hung up on this one.
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Vagabond
Mercenary
Mr. Referee
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 13:26 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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On 2004-06-03 05:06, chihawk wrote:
As I have noted in 2 other places, Randall's ruling is consistent with the rules as written.
A weapon and its ammo is considered one piece of equipment for a vehicle--meaning a weapon's ammo is in one big ammo bin. And you can't have multiple ammo types in a bin.
Mechs separate ammo into ammo slots, vehicles don't--hence the ruling follows the rules as written.
And you need not apply real world logic to this, we've all seen that don't matter in Battletech. You also don't need to mention fluff, there are already tons of places where the fluff of a mech is contrary to the rules.
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simple fix.
just make more than 1 ammo bin on units that will likely have more than 1 ammo type.
weapon 1 crit + 1 2t ammo bin 1 crit + 1 1t ammo bin 1 crit = 3 crit system.
now, it does seem that Fanpro and FASA before them ignored this little bit of construction trivia. as they have tanks mounting ATMs and multiple tons of ammo for weapons that don't need it.
so IMHO fanpro should edit vehicle construction to add multiple bins or to have the 1 large bin considered multi-sectioned. just my 2 c-bills.
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
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Location: United States
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 14:44 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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On 2004-06-03 13:17, -Mud wrote:
For an official tournament, they're constrained by the rules as they are written. For a little throw-down though, I wouldn't get hung up on this one.
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I concur--people should feel free to play as they wish.
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Kiris65
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 17-Dec-2003 00:00
Posts: 371
Location: Panama
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 16:26 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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On 2004-06-03 14:44, chihawk wrote:
I concur--people should feel free to play as they wish.
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true enough, but it sure is fun debating them...don't you think? 
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Motown Scrapper
Clan Ice Hellions
Galaxy Commander
Joined: 24-Jul-2003 00:00
Posts: 2074
Location: United States
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| Posted: 03-Jun-2004 22:49 Post subject: RE: Does this ruling sound as stupid to you as it does to me? |
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You may be interrested in knowing that Randall Bills is issuing an Errata because he decided the rule was stupid too
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